I am currently in the graha sutras audio course and sometimes when Ernst talks about what happens when a planet is strong or weak he refers to the measurement, for example shad bala or planet/sign relationship but oftentimes not and I am confused about what is really ment by it, because in previous courses it was also about lajjiatdi avasthas. So my question is, when generally speaking is a planet considered strong?
Thanks.
1. Dignity
2. ShadBala
Those are the most important factors for planetary strength I think.
Let´s see what the rest of the community has to say about it.
Staffan
@amit Lazy bum/strength to act is cheshta bala no? or is it dig bala ?
I'm dealing with low dig bala stuff, and I have found bigger issue to be not knowing when to act, which kind of makes remain in the passive state for a little longer than ideal.
@amit Someone said to be that a planet with low Dig Bala runs around like a recently decapitated chicken not knowing where to go or what to do. That´s how I see it. But I´m listen to Amit´s concept. The drive or lack thereoff. Hm. Interesting.
I have Mercury in the 7th house. 3 tiny DigBala points. The way it shows, I believe, is that I´m much better to pick up and act on other people´s needs than to realize what I have to communicate or do out of my own needs. It´s tough in relationships. Especially, perhaps, since my Moon is in Uttarphalguna. To me it´s all about teamwork and being part of a couple. Luckily I´ve finally found a woman that is worth my effort and pays back what I put in.
Staffan
Not knowing where to go or what to do is usually Rahu problem because that creates a consciousness of lack on account of evolutionary growth. It can also be Saturn issue as that also creates a consciousness of lack on account of burning bad karmas.
@amit Yeah, I don´t have that luckily, except for a rather strong planetary aspects on my Mercury for both the planets you mentioned, but in this context we only look for Rasi aspects, or not?
I agree, it feels more like a lack of drive than of direction. Although I have a high capacity for absorbing and processing information there is a part of me that is very little curious about things. Which in a way has served me well too, I think. I live abroad on a dangerous continent, and it has probably saved my life not jump on every train everywhere just out of curiosity. And so in life. I found my astrology, I stick to it and don´t look under every stone.
Staffan
Both aspects create delays. Rasi aspects create in terms of concrete stuff and planetary aspects more psychologically.
@amit Yep, yep. It´s subjective of course but I can relate to that. My DB Saturn cooling off my Mercury to begin with. Planetary aspected by around 40 varupas. Lack of enthusiasm, on an already agitated Mercury with low DigBala.
Could Rahu planetary aspecting Mercury contribute to psychic abilities and aspergers / mild autism /? What do you think?
Staffan
Rahu only rasi aspects.
I think for autism need to see what's happening with moon and mercury to start with
@amit Right... This is the part I feel that lacks in Ernsts school; of course he can´t do everything and be everywhere! The segment between basic and advanced, the practical training; when to use Rasi and planetary aspects for example.
I have a wonderful Moon, alone in the 4th house, no harmful rasi aspects to it, no severe planetary aspect, 141 in ShadBala plus Vargottama.
As for Mercury: agitated by the Sun and low DigBala. 40 varupa planetary aspects of Saturn.
Moon and Mercury rasi aspecting each other.
Now whether aspergers is a bad thing or a blessing is up for discussion. A little of both, I guess.
I still don´t see in my horoscope what causes is. Since you are into the cards, I´m a 5 of Clubs and there it seems more likely: 3 of Diamonds as the Sun card, 7 of Diamonds / Mercury card and the highly vibrant King of Diamonds as Uranus card.
Just saying.
Thank you Amit, this is a nice way of learning.
Staffan
3 of diamonds is a psychic card and can also cause somewhat disconnect with physical world, very likely that can cause mild autism. So just see what's happening with sun's avasthas.Interesting enough today I pulled my day card as 3 of diamonds!
In birth chart, need to see d30 and d40 too and what's happening in the rasis of moon and mercury too primarily or another afflicted planets on them like Ernst explained in medical astrology course. And see for sun too from cards perspective.
@amit 3D is a stressful card, but also wonderful in many ways. i have very little interest in the small practicalities of the world as you would guess, and with a DB Saturn putting an IKEA furniture isn´t what I love to do the most, nor repairing a motor or cleaning a car, for that sake. I do it when I have to, but I tend to procrastinate when it comes to that kind of things. But as I said I´m good at not jumping on every train that life puts in front of me, and for that 3D is fantastic. It´s a "no" card. I recline many seemingly good offers, and that has led me to other places that are better for me.
Then I have other factors in my chart that speaks about a high capacity for what we could call energy work, but I feel this is not the right place to speak about that. Also I´m stealing the thread. This is not what it was supposed to be about.
Staffan
@staffan Psychic abilities I would look at the Nakshatra near Rahu or your Moon or Ketu. Look at Michael Reed way of explaining the Nakshatra his last 2 video with Lada is easy to understand, listen to his video on youtube or take the long road to read directly the booklet Ernst Translated. If you haven't already.
Mild autism Could Be Saturn in Aries, it's a Mars Sign. From the Pac course it's related to the period from 1 to 4, mars period. Look for things that happened around that time. Ask a parent who took care of during that time.
You are a 3 of Diamond so the Mars card is important.
And look at the moon lord, And the Avastha to the Lord. My moon is well placed if I don't take into account that his lord is starved by Saturn.
@lorris Wow, thank you! Yes, DB Saturn with Rahu is a strong indication for things not working out in that house, and it´s my 11th, so I´ve had my great deal of meltdowns when it comes to projects /Aries - harvesting the fruits of them/ and groups. Sa/Ra acts like a fainting goat trying to get aboard a swing, it must be fun to see at a distance... There is absolutely no rationality to it and if you don´t learn to forgive and laugh at yourself you are doomed, having this. Is this autism? I guess it must be the main reason that I have it, because my Moon is excellent and there is nothing specially bad with my Mercury as far as I can see, except for low DigBala.
My Moon as I think I said is one of the better; GF, alone in the 4th, good Shadbala and Vargottama. Conjuct Saturn in D9 though, that would be the only blemish, although it strengthen it too, since it´s my AK.
It´s in Uttaraphalguni though, which had made my life to a struggle to find any meaning, until I found the woman that I actually bond to the way an UP Moon needs to. To me the UP is extremely dependant on having a partner, and one that they can really blend together with; I mean project wise etc.
My BC is 5C, it´s the Sun Card that is 3D in my case. Still very important though.
Staffan
@staffan if you didn't watch the PAC course or read the book he recommended. https://astrology-videos.com/forum/pac-in-astrology/books-for-pac-course#post-17479
I had a friend with Saturn Rahu in the 7th in Aries, it was hard for him socially. Gave him bad rep. Women smelled his aggressivity I would say. He wouldn't noticed it. But others would. I always think of Hulk when I see that combination, as the actor have it, explained well in his interview how it wasn't easy to deal with his aggresivity. Also the fact that Ketu is opposite in libra makes him look way cuter than what he portrays unconsciously. Think of how different his transformation is compared to his normal appearance, that's What SAturn Rahu in Aries convey unconsciously.
In the PAC course its well explained there, Saturn and Rahu in Aries gives that for sure, no doubt about that for me. Ernst said Mars and Moon Sign when they are badly afflicted with Saturn gives problems related to that period, and the most anchored behaviour are the Moon and Mars. Moon and Mars afflicted give all kind of child hood trauma, as you learn about them you heal, learn to give yourself a pat on the back, and heal. Just learning about the events sometimes is enough to heal.
@lorris Wow, thank you again. I´m focused on other stuff right now but am going to take the PAC course some day, of course. What you tell doesn´t make me less interested, that I can tell you. Didn´t know that - what you said about afflictions to Mars.
Childhood traumas, yes, and a bad Saturn doesn´t help me to let go of it. Maybe it wasn´t all that horrible, but when you keep letting the movie play over and over again...
Veeery interesting what you say about the hulk actor and your friend. It´s really interesting how actors seems to be casted based on their charts, which I guess they are not. The famous example of Sylvester Stallone have a Saturn afflicted by the Moon, struggling to overcome his inner limitation as depicted in especially the first Rocky movie... I saw Luc Besson´s wonderful movie - at least that´s what I think it is - with Scarlett Johansson raising from a trauma that makes her reach complete liberation. If the data that astro-seek.com provides are correct - Nov 22 1984, 7 AM, New York - she has Ke/Mo/Sa in her 12th house, Moon ruling her 8th. I couldn´t think of a better indication for that to happen. Cardwise she´s a JH, with KH on her Mercury card, ready to let go of every emotional dependency. 7th and 10th cusp falling there, the lord Mercury falling in the twin card KD with the 4th cusp and the ascendant. Fascinating I believe.
Staffan
@staffan My brother has a Mercury Venus conjunction in the 7th. He is a very good listener for sure. But regarding the low shadbala I often see him talking exactly when someone is distracted and can't answer him back. I always saw him do that all my life, exactly pinpoint precision, mercury is in Good dignity. Yet I noticed that before doing any work related to astrology. I do sometimes talk at the wrong time also but it's not as often (mercury in the 10th)
@lorris Hm, interesting. But would that be due to Mercury? What comes to my mind are the Jamini indications for how we fight, like Saturn from a safe place at a distance and Sun openly and with nobility with a sword.
Not saying that you are wrong, I just wonder why a Mercury with low DigBala would cause what you describe?
Staffan
@staffan Don't worry I don't mind being wrong 😆
The way I see it, I think you put it right when you said not talking for yourself, not standing up for your words or something close to that.
I don't even see it as just DigBala anymore, but the philosophy that stand for mercury in the 1st VS mercury in the 7th. With each environment and what they represent. So the 7th are others, you talk for others not yourself you don't get the self development from mercury. Each step you take is for others benefit, you manifest for other people. I could call it "other improvement" instead of "self improvement"
For example Jupiter on the first give wisdom, that wisdom is for yourself, and it will helps other naturally as you grow heavier. Mercury does something similar but in the real world.
So instead of communication for others you communicated for yourself, it's not just communication it's cognizance.
So in my opinion he does that because he doesn't talk for himself, so he never strategized for getting himself to be aware of when to talk, instead he wait until it's too late listening only so that others get their turn, and when there is no turn left he talks. , so he doesn't notice it's not the right moment to talk, as it's should be about him that be talks, be there physically.
It's like he is not there, his absent Earth elements makes him invisible as it's not there, he could communicate for him, so that he learns the cues to know when to speak and when not to. Instead he is focused on others and don't see he is not talking at the right moment. It can be confusing I guess.
Jupiter is easier to understand, but both are adults planets, so for self benefit , yourself, hence they are strong on the first. Mercury on first give confidence on yourself as you learn who you are you can communicate better, you map out your strength trough exquisite magnificent precision that makes everyone look at you because you are good at it, precise, a fine tune clocks that speak for himself, give out a well put out appearance that make someone down to earth and effective. I know someone with mercury on the First in Leo, never once I saw her asked a question at the wrong time, and believe me I watched her in a Group class, asked all kind of question, very good at communication, my mind was blown for sure. I compared her to my brother.
It's the only thing I have seen my brother not do, he is very good at writing, it's beautiful, but he is never present to talk about himself, and when he does I often think before he does, almost close my eyes while he talks, hoping the person heard him. But most often the person wasn't present at that moment looking elsewhere or distracted. It feels like back luck to me.
He has Venus AK, no connection to Saturn or 5th, 2rd, 3rd from it. Saturn DK. If there is something I may I missed are the Nakshatra. His Moon is in Sravana, linked to the ears, so good at listening again. The total opposite of me almost 🤣 , I have Rahu in Sravana.
@lorris You describe it, I think, very well. It also makes you look for confirmation. If the world doesn´t confirm your concepts and ideas you feel that you have no right to embrace it. So you - me in this case, and your brother - overcompensates, stressing out your thoughts and belief in an attempt to convince the world. So that you can believe in it yourself. Frustrating indeed. A perfect setup for frustration, both for the person and the world, since you come out as fanatic. And it makes you both get engaged in the world and take things personal. In my case it doesn´t help having Sa/Ra in the 11th, ensuring that you will seldom harvest any fruit of your efforts to shine in the world...
My wife channels spirits who struggle to teach me to let go and not take things personal and not engage in the world. They are having a hard time with me... So have I. But at the age of 55 I´m finally getting there...
Ernst speaks about a shamed planet as a gateway to consciousness, since it obliges you to embrace your flaws. I believe that Sa/Ra works in a similar way. It creates ridiculous, irrational behaviour that you just have to accept at the end of the day. You have to embrace the fainting goat behaviour that you can´t control. I would love to hear what Ryan Kursczak has to say about that; to my understanding he has Sa/Ra on his lagna.
Staffan
@staffan Yeah it's not easy for sure, I dated a girl with Saturn and Rahu on her Ascendant, and I know 2 other with something similar. Mine is in the 9th house. I met one with Rahu Saturn in the 5th, she had a huge problems with smoking cigarette, she would take one after the other. But she had a very good intuition, moon on Ascendant. I do come out as a "fanatic" indeed, but I don't care anymore, not as much as least 😆 Everyone has their problems, no chart is perfect.
Yeah Ryan has this combination also. I do think it seems less hard for a guy than a woman. But what I would know, I know more women astrology, men don't share those things as easily. I have to rectify mens charts all the time as most don't think it works, it's annoying sometimes.
@staffan Having this conversation with you help me realize something and see charts more clearly. It's being a long time I didn't spend time on a forum writing. I used to be on a forum on self development, in that forum I wrote about 2000 messages, and also forums linked to perfumery, pheromones, and behaviour related to perfume. At one point I stopped it all about 5 years ago and now I only do astrology mostly.
I wrote all that because you probably have an experience opposite of mine. If you have rahu in the 11th. I knew one forum admin, a very successful entrepreneur in psychology who had ketu Saturn conjunction in the 5th. He would spend a lot of time working on ideas, spend time alone writing books or method for self development, a very creative person. And also he created a forum, because Saturn was making him move other there in the 11th house.
Since about 8 month I realized I wasn't using my 5th house as much as I thought I did. Too much time in the 11th, getting knowledge through networking. So I may not have Rahu or ketu in the 5th or 11th, but it doesn't mean that 5 house is sane and perfect, and my Sun is in the 11th. It's like I took this very long time to realize how much that Sun in the 11th influence my life so much.
@lorris Interesting. Mind sharing your birth dates?
I had a huge revalation regarding my 5th and 11th house earlier this year when I watched Ryan Kurczaks ascendant classes on YT. I´m a Gemini ascendant, meaning that the 5th is the natural DB position for the Sun. Meaning, as I came to understand it, and also how I experience it, that for a Gemini being creative for the sake of creativy isn´t very fulfilling. Our Sun is exalted in the 11th, so we need to work for a collective goal and have a sharing experience for creativity to have a purpose. Which is something I have been struggling with all my life. For example I´m a good photographer I believe, www.instagram.com/mattiassigurdsson, but being a bad networker and having a pessimistic DB Saturn in the 11th (giving up...) has made me give up. I have never had an exposition.
... Which I´m kind of glad for now that I´m realizing that my main talent and purpose is chanting and praying. Mars in Chittra in 5th, not a very good Mars but it still works very good in that sense. I guess it´s helped by being by Ketu and Jupiter. And my very good AK Moon, of course; I really tune into the rhythm of the drum and the rattle, I feel every little bad stroke with the drumstick or the rattle and is overwhelmed by shame, which helps me to aline and basically get into trance with ease. In the Navamsa Mars is exalted, funny enough, in the 11th with the 12th cusp present. Ruling a 6th house stacked of planets. Jupiter and Ketu that are in the 5th in the Rasi and Venus which is ruling that same 5th. My Lagna lord is Gemini, so with AK Moon: A healer.
Staffan
@staffan https://drive.google.com/file/d/1kqR3GdZDeADKEITiGdj90eTKdt2ZWy24/view?usp=sharing , use the top right button to download the chart file
If I Can have yours too, that would be great.
@lorris Thank you, cool with the sharing. I don´t know how to do that though; these are may birthdates:
Dec 13 1968, 15.43.58, Växjö (Vaxjo, Vaexjoe) Sweden
Or is it possible to just attach it...?
Staffan
@staffan I tried to attach but it wasn't working, don't worry it's not that important just for one chart.
@lorris So interesting... I need to practice a lot more on general chart reading. We could start a group? Or meet on Zoom? Or we could start two threads here on the forum inviting everyone who wants to chip in with their piece of analysis of whatever they might see and/or want to discuss.
I´ve just glanced at your chart and don´t have any time to go deeper. What first caught my eye, of course, is your Lagna lord Venus in the 12th. I´m curios about how that plays out. Venus in a Mars sight gives passion, so passion in the most "moksha" of the moksha houses... Passion for meditation, foreign countries, spiritual practices in general...? Passion for moksha; that´s a contradiction I guess... Has it caused you any health issues, since it´s your Lagna lord? It´s also your 6th lord though so maybe it protects you from enemies and disease?
Staffan
@staffan I don't have many health issue as far as I can tell, most people see me as very healthy, rarely tired. But once I was very sensitive to sound, just before I found astrology back in 2013.
Venus in Aries in the 12th, that's something sometimes I myself ponder about. But I think I spend a lot of time alone, searching all kind of mystery. My room is like a laboratory, so many essential oil, mixture, test I have done.
I saw your cards, it picked my interest more, Moon 7 of Diamond, Your Ketu in the Jack of heart with Jupiter and Mars. Sun in the 5 of spade, I have my Moon there.
We could do a zoom I think to talk, though today I can't.
@staffan I can see why you didn't agree with me I think on mercury on the 7th, you have your moon in Virgo in the 4th, it probably helps you communicate better than just someone who has mercury in the 7th. Maybe it's that.
@lorris Oh, I did agree, I´ve been quite convinced of the idea that people don´t listen to me / as they should, according to guess who... /, now realizing that it´s more me not picking up the signals that they actually do. Frustrating for both me and the people around me. :-/
But my Moon in the 4th is a blessing of course, always come to my help, and so is my mooncard: Ace of Spades, always ready to start over after any kind of crisis.
Staffan
When you are beginning I would say don't use all the Shadbala details, use only the 3 most important which are Digbala , Uccha Bala (how close to exaltation), and Chesta Bala. When I first read Graha sutra and listen to the audio I was lost also in that vast area of which Strength to use, so many things to chose from that I got lost in it, it's good to know it all but better to make it work first. Then add the details later on as you have a good solid results first.
Then add the Avastha on top of it, the Avastha are the good and bad behaviour, one that reap rewards and the others that don't, or the neutral behaviour. Take a look at the newer class, they are simpler sometimes with updated information, a more precise and better way to look at things.
When you read the part on the elements of the planet, there is a newer course on that, it really helps you connect with the planet's energy. You could probably forget the whole Graha sutra book and only focus on elements, and use those elements in addition to the Strength on top of the Avathas. They are examples videos in the last video of this class here:
https://astrology-videos.com/courses/beginner-courses/understanding-the-5-elements
Look at the last video first, it will give a target to aim for, what strengths are, how to used it. Then go back and forth between examples and elementals explanation, takes notes, right it down on paper, make a map out of it, use colors and pretty things that add nuance for your subconscious to grasp it's important, make it look important in your behavior as you write it down, and also you can meditate on the mantra of each respective planet to help you learn, repeat it even if it doesn't make sense at first. Also you may look at sanskrit definition of word, in the Sutra. Translate it on a website, read all the definition related to each word, the elements may make more sense then.
Also sometimes the answer is so simple it's mind-blowing, sometimes we expect the answer to be hard to get, sometimes all you need to do is the most imbecile things everybody does at school, which is repetition, but the good repetition. Try and test on a lot of charts until you get confortable.
One thing that may escape our awareness is that we see repetition sometimes as stupid, or that repetition isn't going to help us get intuition, but it does exactly that. So even the dumbest person can be intuitive, though that intuition could also be wrong, as you need to focus on the right thing to intuit.
@lorris I'm sure things will get more clear when i have done all the classes. I am just struggling to understand my jupiter and sun which are very low in shad bala 79% jupiter and 63% sun. Jupiter is also in capricorn with sun and mars (and uranus and neptun). Sun is neutral in composed dignity and both are good in lajjitadi avasthas (sun 792 and jupiter 692.9) but shouldn't the low shad bala and debilitation of jupiter indicate someone very dull and uninterested in philosophy or worse? I believe in a loving creator and mother earth as a living being, be vegan/vegetarian, a libertarian, unvacced, I don't blame others or circumstances for mishappenings, be mostly contend, have high goals and study astrology. I would consider that top notch philosophy 😀 Can you see how that would correspond?
@lorris I'm sure things will get more clear when i have done all the classes. I am just struggling to understand my jupiter and sun which are very low in shad bala 79% jupiter and 63% sun. Jupiter is also in capricorn with sun and mars (and uranus and neptun). Sun is neutral in composed dignity and both are good in lajjitadi avasthas (sun 792 and jupiter 692.9) but shouldn't the low shad bala and debilitation of jupiter indicate someone very dull and uninterested in philosophy or worse? I believe in a loving creator and mother earth as a living being, be vegan/vegetarian, a libertarian, unvacced, I don't blame others or circumstances for mishappenings, be mostly contend, have high goals and study astrology. I would consider that top notch philosophy 😀 Can you see how that would correspond?
You probably have an exalted Jupiter in one of the important Varga, or a very good D9 or D60.
Low Shadbala Sun look at Yogananda life, it means you get not to chose in life, he wanted to meditated but got himself to work instead. Low Shadbala Sun I sometimes use it to broadly rectify a chart. I look at a movie, if the Actor is never in the leadership role, don't get to chose where to go, etc, is a "slave" to the empire basically one would say, or the government, or his life. Also usually spend a lot of time at home as it's where the Sun is placed usually when weak in shadbala, home environment. So low Shadbala Sun just means you won't attract the leadership role to decide where your life is going to go.
Jupiter and mars helps each other, you can look at that for a little help. Jupiter help the Sun too, it's not the hurtful conjunctions. Don't pay attention to Uranus or Neptune they aren't important unless it's for Transit.
Jupiter in Cap I notice people tend to have a belief linked to earth, or Saturnian belief system. It doesn't make them not care for philosophy by itself, it's just one factor, if other factors are contradicting that you will still like those subject.
I can't guess everything unless I see you chart though 🙂
The good lajjitadi avasthas means your have friends or someone helping you with that Planet role, a father, a mother, a friends, someone that helped you with that thing in your life, and when they helped you it stayed in your consciousness, so that you attract that in your life.
Also check the house the planets it's in, if it's an angle you still use a lot that planet, Trine also.
@lorris Well, I am still young, 28, so i gotta see how life plays out, I can see what you described above so far. Jupiter is exalted in D7, 24 and 27 its debilitated in D9 but venus is exalted there, my D60 is pretty good if its correct because i am not too sure about my birthtime, did they wrote 19:55 because it was exact or was it an assumption more of 😀 I understand one needs to see the whole chart I still just don't really get it because I feel I should be doing worse in these regards. Capricorn is my 6th house by the way which I respond very much to, I like natural healing methods and getting info about the daily battles to overcome obstacles.. thanks 🙂