If Saturn is supposed to be lazy, why does he make us work hard? The concepts are at odds with each other. So are they to be used in balance, or one is to be given up for the other?
@ernst if Saturn is meant to be lazy and that's what he does best, then shouldn't it be a good thing to have Saturn in the 4th house? What better place to be lazy then in the comfort of your own home, yes?
@kam Saturn is lazy as a self-preservation instinct. It’s also detached so, in the 4th house, it can cut the person from being in touch with their needs and happiness. According to the Hellenistic tradition (and Tajika as well I believe), Saturn has its joy in the 12th house (what better place than the 12th to be detached?) and in Vedic its Dig Bala in the 7th. I think in the 4th, it can be a tough one, depending on other factors of course (I have Saturn in Cancer which is different yet comparable, tough to know what I truly want, especially at a young age, definitely gets better with age:)
@mona in my case, I know what I want. I just can't have it. So I have no choice but to do the things that Ernst mentioned. Saturn is in a neutral sign for me in Sagittarius but with lots of afflictions via aspects.
@kam My Saturn has its Lajjitaadi Avasthas challenges and is strongly aspecting most of my other planets. In other words, it's all over my chart! I've learned to love Saturn. It teaches me realism, self-sufficiency, and patience. And, it's full of wisdom and humor, like the tough love grandpa I've never had 😉
That's a good question that I have wondered about as well.
I think Saturn will do anything for survival and basic security, and doesn't waste energy or money on trivial pursuits, luxuries, power, or even sattvic creative ideals.
Maybe Saturn's laziness is a from of simplicity. Being grateful when they are able to just survive and stay secure and reproduce. (Ernst does seem to be the only astrologer that describes Saturn as a sexual planet. But the way he does makes sense as sex is a basic part of nature and survival on earth.)
Also reptiles, Saturn creatures, may appear to be lazy and slow most of the time, but they spend a lot of time methodically watching and stalking, and conserving their physical energy for the moments of aggressive struggle when they catch their prey to feed themselves.
Maybe Saturn makes us work hardest when we need, or have neglected to build, an authentic foundation of security, or have ignored the harsh realities of life and time until it finally forces us to catch up the best we can to continue our survival. And doing that while at the same time continuing to aim, and work for, the good stuff of the other planets, can add up to loads and loads of work!
S.
Every planet wants to manifest the house its in. They all do it in different ways. Saturn does it by waiting. There is NOTHING that can be done to the house saturn is in. So saturn goes to sleep. when he wakes up, its better. The problem is when saturn is afflicted. when its starved, etc. Then a person starts to beat a dead horse and they end up depressed cause all the energy is going to where no energy should be placed. Saturn is the greatest planet in many ways. Go to sleep, forget about it, let time take care of it. go do something else.
@ernst thanks Ernst
This is a very accurate description of my life. I've got Saturn conjunct Uranus in the 4th.
@ernst I love it...that's the reason your course Bach Flower Remedies is so amazing. It makes us realizing how much we compensate where Saturn is (especially when afflicted like you've mentioned), and that there is healing that can be done, and it works. I've had a few clients on a few remedies and it helped them. I had one in particular with Saturn in 4th in Cancer, that said it changed her life and that taking those remedies for a few months was the equivalent of many therapist sessions where she didn't have a break thru.
@ernst This is very different than what I had been rationalizing to myself about Saturn.
No wonder Saturn gets so starved by Mars!
But they are both tamasic and Mars gets exalted in a Saturn's own sign in the root chakra.
I wish there was a way to take Mars out of Saturn's house and put him in one where he can be more productive. Maybe a gem that puts him in the 6th house if thats not a dusthana from where he really is.
There is certain pain in life such as loss of a loved one that there is nothing you can do but suffer and let time take care of it. A good Saturn is great for such pain since Saturn is a planet of suffering...
tuyet