I try not to engage in discussions on the forum, but fromthis matter that I have personal experience that I want to share. I have shame in my chart.
Just as Ernst says in the lajjitaadi avasthas course: shaming is a tough sentiment, but it´s also a window for spiritual growth. So if the client is into personal development, and if the astrologer share this philosophy of course, the shaming may actually be the pole that we use to swing into the reign of God. Ernst mentions Saint Francis of Assisis as an example of a person who based his spiritual growth, possibly enlightment, based on his consciousness about his shame. If you really have to overcome your shame you have no other option and to embrace it, and by doing that you embrace your whole being and all of God´s creation.
Shaming is painful, indeed. But as soon as we classify it as something innately bad we shame the person once again, and miss the opportunity to turn the matter around. The clients should be encouraged to look at the shame as an opportunity to get in deep touch with themselves and with God.
Staffan
Lots of good responses here and as someone with lots of shamed planets I responate with giving positive aspects first the most. However, even better than that is connecting them with thier inspiration and vision for thier life. When I do readings for these charts I will say something about the potential that the chart has and also something with the dasas about when they can get a taste of that. After some discussion and feeling like they are fairly secure on a path of vision, then I will go through what's in the way of obtaining that. I don't necessarily go for the shame first, depends on the person and what I think they can take and what in the dasas says they will experience. But if they relate an event that you can see is involved in shame then it's very helpful to clear up the confusion.
Sometimes a direct approach is too strong so you could look at the shame planets and either through planetary ages or dasas ask them if an event happened at an earlier time/childhood if it's indicated.
Breaking through some levels of shame for myself, during the shaming moments I have to say to myself "remember your true worth and value, stand in the recognition of your inherent value and reconnect with your true intention in the situation". That of course works if someone has some inspiration and vision in thier life, which is mostly a Sun governed thing so getting them connected to that is crucial.
Of course telling an unprepared person that the shame carries a core of liberation is similar to conveying the idea that severe illness or loss may something positive to it.
Most people aren´t prepared for that, of course. But many people can, if you work with them for a longer period, open up for the idea little by little.
Staffan
Food for thoughts: Maybe shaming in a chart is an invitation to gain consciousness about your shame and shameful behaviour, rather than making you a more shameful person than anyone else.
Maybe the shame surfaces and manifests more in the life of a person with shaming, without that necessarily meaning that there is more of it or that it´s worse.
I don´t know. I just think it´s a nicer perspective from a therapeutical point of view.
But of course it may lead to people taking pride in their shame...
How I understand the eremites! Well, I´ve more or less become one myself. It´s hard to guide people and I´m not sure we should even try unless they really insist on being guided.
Staffan
Yogananda says there are three types of people .Those you dont need to be told what to do cause they are already doing whats really neccessary and moving forward. People wiht good adult planets tend to be like this.
Those who need to be told what to do and when told are appreciative, do it, and move forward. These are people with decent child planets who have weak adult planets that would normally help them move forward.
Those who need to be told what to do but get upset, hurt, antagonistically, distant, etc. when told what to do. People with shamed planets are especially supseptical to this. In the end, all one can do is realize that these people will do what needs to be done when there is no other option. SO all we can do is accept them, not get involved with them in areas where they need improvement, and wait for life to tell them.
The acceptance is what is really important. Its important not to BABY them, but to ACCEPT them, these are different things. Shamed needs to learn self-acceptance more than anyone else. Its thier own lack of self-acceptance that makes it so painful to hear they need to do something different and makes helpful words sound very critical to them. Once they accept themselves on this level, they can take advice.
